SCOTT SIMON, HOST:
The U.S.-brokered peace deal between Israel and Hamas has entered its second day. The first phase includes a ceasefire and partial Israeli military withdrawal. It also requires Hamas to release all 20 of the living hostages held since October 7, 2023, as well as the bodies of those who have died. In exchange, Israel will release nearly 2,000 prisoners and detainees, most of them held without any charges. Of course, the bulk of the deal remains up for negotiation. Shibley Telhami is the Anwar Sadat professor for peace and development at the University of Maryland. Professor Telhami, thanks for being back with us.
SHIBLEY TELHAMI: And good morning to you.
SIMON: Why do you think both parties agreed to this deal?
TELHAMI: Well, I think it's - you know, as President Trump has actually said, both parties are certainly exhausted. But in the end, honestly, I think the Trump administration decided that a ceasefire is really needed, particularly, I think, given strategic shifts that have taken place within the U.S. The Trump administration is feeling the heat. Half of Americans now believe that what's happening in Gaza is genocide. His own supporters are divided with many very angry with what's happening in Gaza - and internationally, particularly after Israel had actually launched the attack on Qatar, an American ally. All of this really put a lot of pressure on the Trump administration to act.
But let's be real here. What's also happened is that essentially the Arab allies have persuaded Hamas that it's wise, even up front, to release all the Israeli hostages. It has seen those hostages essentially as bargaining chips with Israel, and it has been persuaded otherwise. So all of these things have come together. But what we really have, and let's be clear, is not really a - more than essentially a hostage to release deal, ceasefire with uncertain term and a prayer. That's what we have. We don't have a peace deal.
SIMON: Well, let me ask you about one of the items on this really 20-point plan, is the demilitarization of Gaza, which would entail the disarmament of Hamas and dismantling what Israel says is Hamas infrastructure. Is that a popular idea among Palestinians?
TELHAMI: Well, let's put it this way. First of all, Hamas has agreed only to Phase 1. All of these other points of the plan, many of them, Hamas has not agreed to. So these would have to be negotiated. This has always been an Israeli demand, and certainly it is part of what has - part of the 20-point plan that the Trump administration put together. Hamas itself has said that it is prepared in the context of a Palestinian takeover of a national agreement not to be part of governing Gaza. So they have not really, you know, sort of, accepted this idea. And that obviously leaves so much vagueness that they can exploit, just like the Israeli government can exploit all the vagueness. So Palestinians are divided on this. In part, you know, the - many of them don't agree with Hamas but feel that it has the right to fight the Israeli occupation. So it's a divided issue, but nothing has agreed on this issue at this point.
SIMON: How realistic is a two-state solution right now?
TELHAMI: You know, I've always believed and I've written about this before October 2023, saying, you know, the promise of two-state has become essentially a smokescreen to hide a one-state unjust reality that has existed. I think since - in the last two years, that reality has been entrenched. I think the main issue remains the same, which is the position of the American government. As you know, what we have is an increasing international recognition of two states, including in Europe. But the U.S. is the main party here preventing it from happening - preventing it from happening by not allowing the Security Council to admit a state of Palestine and recognizing it.
SIMON: Is there regional support for this peace plan? I apologize. We just have half a minute left.
TELHAMI: No, yes. I think there is regional - I think, look, everybody is desperate. They haven't been able to stop the carnage in Gaza. Public opinion is going against the governments, and everybody wants to see some end to it. And so they're - you know, they're seizing the moment here. But it's really - they're basing, you know, their faith on Trump being able to stay the course and deliver, and that is way too much to hope for.
SIMON: Shibley Telhami, thanks very much for being with us.
TELHAMI: Pleasure. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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